Stuff Interior Designers Need To Know: Insider Industry Advice for Residential Interior Designers

Ep. 6: A Logo Is NOT A Brand! and Other Essential Marketing Advice from Website Designer Robyn White

• Rebecca West

Share episode

In this episode of Stuff Interior Designers Need to Know we enjoy a masterclass on marketing strategies for interior designers with Robyn White of RDW Design Studio, a website design firm dedicated to Interior Designers.

She may have come to the industry thanks to an embarrassing addiction to HGTV <cue the cringe lol> but she's since learned exactly what it actually takes to be a professional interior designer offering luxury services to exacting clients, and loves helping designers not only get found, but become The One to find! Of course, it helps that before Robyn did this work she spent ten years serving discerning clients in the luxury sector as the Vice President of the Manhattan location of an international art gallery. Fancy! ✨ 

This episode is a must-listen for anyone who needs to understand the big picture of marketing as an interior design business owner. Whether you're going to hire a professional website designer, or are still in the DIY phase, there is something for you in this episode!

Find Robyn at RDW Design Studio, or be friends with her on Instagram at @rdwdesignstudio! 

---

Looking for my Interior Design Business Coaching & Courses? 💪
👉 seriouslyhappy.com

Wanna be Interior Design & Expat Insta-Friends?! 😊
👉 @beseriouslyhappy

Follow my Moving-To-France, Living-In-Paris Expat Adventures 🇫🇷
👉 Bonjhola podcast

And here's where to find my Book on Interior Design Psychology 📚
 👉 Happy Starts at Home

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

So, brand new out of the gate, and this is going to sound strange coming from a website designer. I don't recommend investing in a custom website design. The reason I say that is, in the 1st, Two years of business, everything's going to change.

Welcome to stuff. Interior designers need to know the podcast where the title says it all. If you're a residential interior designer and interior design business owner, this is the place to find out the stuff you need to know to succeed in business and create a business that makes you seriously happy. Today, we're talking to Robin white of RDW design studio, about what she wishes interior designers knew about website design. Now while I thought our conversation was going to be about layouts, and colors, and fonts. What you're about to hear is actually a big picture conversation about marketing strategy. You know, that thing you need to have in order to spend your marketing time and money effectively. Robin's got advice for you about everything from SEO to portfolio photography. So let's take this peak inside a website designer's brain and find out just what we interior designers need to know. Hi, Robin. Thank you so much for joining.

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

Hi, Rebecca. I'm so happy to be here. Thanks for having me on as a guest. That

rebecca_1_10-23-2024_170508:

I am delighted to have this conversation because, of course, interior designers, or I should say any business owner, one of the very first things that they are going to attack is building a website, and so this is very fundamental information for everybody. So, to get people oriented, my understanding is that you don't just design websites, you specifically design them for interior designers, is that correct?

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

is correct. Yes, I've niched down and the industry that I specialize in is interior design. I just love working with other creatives. I love the fact that they do such beautiful work. I have the most amazing visuals to work with in my designs.

rebecca_1_10-23-2024_170508:

So did you choose that right out the gate or was there a little bit of a journey coming to this niche?

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

a good question. There was a little bit of a journey. when I decided to start this business, I hired a business coach, which is something I highly recommend to people because it really moves the needle along a lot faster. One of the things that she really focused on was niching down. I truly had no idea who I wanted to work with, so I started doing some soul searching and investigating making lists. What do I love doing? What do I enjoy? Things like that. And. What kept coming up and my clients hate when I say this, I relax in the evenings by watching TV. I watch HGTV and I'm like, you know, I love this. Why don't I start working with interior designers? Then I took time learning about the industry, joining Facebook groups that allowed industry partners in that were for interior designers, read the posts, read the answers to the posts. So I could see. What they were struggling with, what business issues there were. So I had a really good understanding of it. I so very quickly realized everything on HGTV is completely wrong, false, bad representation of the industry, which is why my clients all cringe when they hear me tell this story. story, but it is what really got me into that niche. Now I'm in my sixth year of working with interior designers. So the great thing is when they come to me, like, I've heard it. I know exactly where they are, what they're doing. They're saying what they're struggling with, with their website, what they need from their website. It's been tremendously helpful to have niched down.

rebecca_1_10-23-2024_170508:

Yeah. Um, wow. Okay. So I knew where I was gonna go, but now I have 100 different questions for you. I love that you actually came from that love of HGTV, It seems to me like it would give you some insight into the disconnect that a lot of clients actually show up to a designer with. I know you're not doing the copywriting, you're doing the design, but does that inform how you design the websites and what's included in order to bridge that disconnect

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

It absolutely does, and I have a copywriter on my team. So we, we do it all in house. What I have found is the words on your website, and the design of your website must be Go hand in hand in order to have a really strategic website. I work very closely with my copywriter and I'm incredibly involved in the messaging that goes on my clients websites and yes, that disconnect between what the world thinks the interior design industry is and what it actually is, is something that we do need to broach on the website a lot of that can come through in, um, having an FAQ section that can address some of the, general questions that a potential lead might have. And being careful about how you are answering those FAQs so that they realize, okay, what I'm seeing there isn't really how it works. Mm

rebecca_1_10-23-2024_170508:

Yeah, absolutely. So I didn't realize that you had a copywriter in house. Do you ever work with people who are bringing in their own copy or are you specifically always using a process where it's all in house?

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

I will work with people who are writing their own copy, although I do not recommend it at all. I will work with someone who has their own copywriter, but I would say 99 percent of the time my clients are searching for a website designer before they're searching for a copywriter and having one in house who I'm project managing so they're not signing two separate Contracts dealing with two separate service providers, um, just makes the whole process so much more simple and seamless for them. I have a graphic designer on my team as well. So we do branding too, which again is another facet of web design. They all have to tie in together.

rebecca_1_10-23-2024_170508:

They really do. I recently interviewed a copywriter specific to our industry, and that, uh, chicken versus egg question comes up, whose job comes first? So I'm actually curious within your team, is everybody working in tandem or is there an order of action into which each team member does their job?

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

Yeah, that's such a good question. I will just say all website designers have a different process and work differently.

rebecca_1_10-23-2024_170508:

Kind of like all interior designers.

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

Exactly. So if you're hiring me and my team. So there's the 3 of us working together with you. So 4 of us working together, it is a very collaborative process. And the 1st phase is strategy and preparation. We start out with the 4 of us on a zoom call going over the strategy questionnaire that we've sent you. That has all three of our questions on there. Um, and we go through that all together. And then my graphic designer starts working on color palettes and typography. My copywriter starts working on sort of a tone of voice check. And I start thinking about SEO because I also do search engine optimization and all of my website builds, which is.

rebecca_1_10-23-2024_170508:

My goodness,

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

And then I'm involved in the zoom calls with the graphic designer and my client going over color palettes, typography and logo concepts. I am involved in reading through and offering comments on my copywriters. copy. Um, and we're doing an SEO call as well, coming up with a keyword and content strategy, which is then shared with the copywriter. So those keywords can be woven into the pages were optimizing for Google. Yep. So it is a collaborative effort. We are all working together..That being said, I don't actually start the design and build until I have all of the content in hand. So I actually prefer to design around the copy.

rebecca_1_10-23-2024_170508:

which is what I hear from most people that I've had this conversation with that at the end of the day, the words, the message has to be formed first so that we know what kind of containers we're putting that into

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

Absolutely. And, you know, I've been working with my copywriter for probably 3 years now, almost exclusively. So we've got a really good process. If I have certain design concepts in my head before she started writing, I will share those with her, um, so she knows how to structure the copy a little bit differently. We have a very fluid back and forth. Yeah.

rebecca_1_10-23-2024_170508:

So I would normally save this question till near to the end, but since I'm super excited about this is all in house, it makes me wonder how many dollar signs are we really talking about here? Because this is the whole kit and caboodle. Is it a million dollars?

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

not a million dollars, but it's five figures. Yes. I'm never going to be your cheapest option, nor do I want to be. That's not my brand or my business. We're bringing a tremendous amount of value to the website build because, you know, aside from getting the copy, the visual brand, the website, you're also getting a search engine optimized website, um, which is something that most website designers are not offering. I would hope most website designers are doing a search engine friendly website, but that's not the case either at all. So, um, you're getting an awful lot and it's a pretty substantial sized website as well. It's not like we're just doing five pages.

rebecca_1_10-23-2024_170508:

So do you find that usually you're working with more advanced designers or are you often somebody's first website? Where do you tend to

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

My custom website design, I'm working with established designers who, um, this is not their first website. They have clarity around who their target audience is, uh, what their different offerings are, they have that clarity cause they've been doing this for a while and they either had somebody DIYed it. They're at a point now where they're really looking to level up. They're in growth mode. They're trying to attract a more high end premium client, and their current website is just not working for them. I do offer website templates. That's really how I'm able to work with newer designers.

rebecca_1_10-23-2024_170508:

What advice do you have for brand new out of the gate people to set themselves up for success?

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

So, brand new out of the gate, and this is going to sound strange coming from a website designer. I don't recommend investing in a custom website design. The reason I say that is, in the 1st, Two years of business, everything's going to change. You're going to start out thinking that you're offering X, Y, Z, and A, B, C. You really don't know what your services are. You really don't know who you want to work with yet. You really don't have your process fine tuned yet. You really don't know yet what makes you unique because that's something that takes quite a while to figure out. Everything's going to change. So if you come out of the gate investing five figures in a custom website, it's going to have to be redone sooner rather than later. Whereas I think this should be an investment that's lasting you for quite a while. So, um, You should either do it yourself on 1 of the D. I. Y. platforms. Um, just keep it nice and simple or you can hire a professional and get a template. So that it's a professionally designed site,

rebecca_1_10-23-2024_170508:

and are your templates meant for a certain, um, system like Wix, Weebly, you know, the various options out

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

so I have niche down in industry. I work with interior designers. I've also niche down in the platform that I use. So I design exclusively in WordPress. So they are WordPress templates. Yeah.

rebecca_1_10-23-2024_170508:

And you find that WordPress is newbie friendly if they're using the right template.

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

Well, I offer my templates in a very different way. So it's not like it's a 250 template that you're just buying and then you're on your own to figure it all out. That's scary. There's too much tech involved. Mine, I actually customize the template for my clients. They're given a resource library in Google Drive that Gives them some guides about how to pull all of their content together. And there's forms to fill out to submit their content to me, all of their images to me, and I upload and format it all into the template for them with their branding and launch it. So they don't have to deal with any of that technical scary stuff.

rebecca_1_10-23-2024_170508:

Wow. I feel like you might be underselling yourself when you just call it a template. It's a lot more than

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

It is more than that, but, um, what's removed from it is all of the strategy that you get with the custom website design and all of the access to me and the handholding so, um, it is still a template. The design is set. We're not changing the design. So this is 1 of those instances where you're actually writing your copy around an existing. Design.

rebecca_1_10-23-2024_170508:

So you mentioned that you want, once we're investing a lot of money into our website, you really want that to last. And it kind of makes me think about. How we talk about quality and investments within interior design. How long should somebody expect their website to last them? If it's done well, are we talking two years, five years, 20 years?

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

That's a hard question to answer. Your website, in my opinion, is a living, breathing creature that should never just be put out there and left. It should always be, um, added to. And updated. I would say at least on a yearly basis, you want to be looking at the messaging. And looking at your offers, are those still the services that you're offering? are you still working with the same ideal client? Is your process still the same? Um, I'm sure you've got new project photos and new testimonials that need to be going on there. If you're blogging, obviously you should be in there a lot more frequently. frequently. um, even if you've got a design that can last for several years, you still need to be making content updates to your website. So I would say, four or five years on average would just be like a general guesstimation that I would give if you're not going with a super trendy kind of design, and I try to stay away from the trendy and try to keep it much more timeless and classic so it can last longer.

rebecca_1_10-23-2024_170508:

Because it sounds like in, in website design, we're dealing with all the same trends and aspects of things that can go out of date as we are in interior design.

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

absolutely. Yeah, but I would say you want 1 that's going to last you several years, but again, it's not a set it and forget it kind of thing.

rebecca_1_10-23-2024_170508:

Well, yeah, you got to maintain your house and clean it too, right?

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

exactly. Exactly. I love that analogy.

rebecca_1_10-23-2024_170508:

So tell us what makes you roll your eyes to the back of your head when it comes to interior designers and website design. What do you really wish we knew?

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

Well, I guess the, the number 1 thing is. is how important professional photography is to a successful website. You should be pricing your projects so that you are factoring in the cost of a professional photographer I know when you're first starting out, it is really hard to have the extra funds to hire a professional but we can see the difference. The difference is obvious, I'll give you an example. I recently worked with a lovely designer. even though she'd been in business for a really long time This was her 1st website, And, we could not do a full screen image at the top of her pages, because the quality of the photos was not good enough. It was just too pixelated. She had used a lot of her own photography for her projects. And if she had hired a professional photographer, this would never have been an issue. So it restricted the design that we were able to achieve, and that can get really frustrating for both myself and my clients. the other thing I would say that I wish they knew is a logo is not branding.

rebecca_1_10-23-2024_170508:

Oh, my goodness. How many hours of my life I have destroyed by obsessing over a logo in us more about that. Mm

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

I look at brands in two different ways. There are your brand foundations and your brand visuals. And you need to know your brand foundations before you can do brand visuals. What I mean by that with your brand foundations is you need to know who your ideal client is. You need to know, your why, um, what makes you unique, Um, you know, how you want people to feel, When they interact with your brand and your business, you know, that's just some of the things you need to know. And you also need to be authentic to yourself and know what your personality is. And until you have clarity around that, you cannot develop strategic brand visuals because you guys all know colors evoke certain emotions. So do fonts. Right? So if you are fun and whimsical and creative, you are going to use really different color palette and typography than if you are sophisticated, elegant and buttoned up. Right. So if you don't know that and you don't know how you want people to feel and you don't know what you are, then how can we select colors and fonts and then how do we create a logo?

rebecca_1_10-23-2024_170508:

You are preaching to the choir here. And actually it takes me back to what you were saying about photos. This can be really tricky when designers are newer and they don't have a lot of projects to photograph, but not every project is going to align with the kinds of projects you want more of. So be really careful about investing all that professional photography money into a project that is going to lead to more of the same. If it's not what you want, clients are, I find they're very literal.

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

I agree. You really want to be showcasing your best work along with the kind of work you want to attract more of. an example I often use is if your ideal client are bachelors in their twenties, you should not be showing images of playrooms and nurseries in your portfolio. Right.

rebecca_1_10-23-2024_170508:

This is why I get so excited about helping newer designers niche, because it is either a happy cycle that you put yourself into or a really unhappy cycle that you never quite seem to claw out of because you're literally sending a contradicting message to the world about what you want and it's only going to give you what you've literally put out there.

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

And that's just to kind of go off on a tangent for a little bit. That's a reason why your website is so important. People come to me and they say, well, I get all of my clients from word of mouth and referrals, and I'm like, that's wonderful. Good for you. Congratulations. Big capital B U T. But. Referrals are often more of what you've already done. When you first start out you might be doing things differently and cheaper, And then as you grow and evolve, those referrals from earlier clients are going to be misaligned with where you are now. So while referrals are wonderful, and I would always say that you should strive for them, just bear in mind, it's not sustainable to keep your business running just on referrals.

rebecca_1_10-23-2024_170508:

Plus most humans, even if they get a referral, the very first thing they're going to do is go look at your resume. Website or your social feed

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

They sure do. And something that's so important about that is if you get a glowing referral and the person goes and looks at your website and your website. isn't to the standard of that glowing referral, that is going to show a disconnect and breed distrust in their mind. And they may not reach out to you. Your website could be losing you clients because of that.

rebecca_1_10-23-2024_170508:

Yes. You were talking about how you were on Facebook groups and I'm sure you've seen designers lamenting the fact that their clients don't trust them, but it's because we've missed so many opportunities to build trust. And so we're climbing up a mountain that's covered in gravel and constantly losing footing when we don't need to. And the website is such an important part of that because it's the introduction to your company. It's the introductions process, as you've already pointed out. And then I'm curious, I'd like to ask you a bit about the questionnaire, the contact forms. I have a lot of opinions about how that shapes expertise and trust. What's your view on contact forms and questionnaires?

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

Love this question, Rebecca. Thank you for asking it. I have really strong opinions about contact forms. I hope ours align. The contact form. I truly feel should change based on where you are in your business. If you're just starting out and you are desperate for clients, perhaps make it simpler. So it is not a barrier to entry. Maybe we aren't asking all of those probing questions. At this point in your business, you just want the inquiries coming in. Right. But then, when you're more established, and we need to use the contact form to kind of weed out the people that we don't want to work with, then I feel that it needs to be, um, Much longer and ask more probing questions and I'll use my own form as an example. it is long. There are a lot of questions. They're all required. And there is no other way to contact me, except fill that out. And if you reach out to me on social media, I will respond very nicely with a link to my contact page This is part of your lead management process. Your contact page should be a place where you're setting boundaries and expectations from the very beginning. Do you want the contact form submit button automatically taking them to calendly or acuity to schedule with you? Do you want anyone to be able to get on your calendar? Or are you like me? I want to read the submissions before I send you my calendar link. I don't want just anyone getting on my calendar. What if I can tell right away we're not the right fit? Right. But again, there's no right or wrong. It really depends where you are in your business. What kind of form you should have. I would love to hear what your thoughts on contact forms.

rebecca_1_10-23-2024_170508:

Well, first of all, it's like we're sisters. I agree with almost everything that you said, and it parallels my journey. in the last. Seven years of the business, our contact form was very extensive and that's because we were so clear on who we were best able to help and we had pricing signaling on there, everything was required. And my point of view was always, if they're not willing to put a little bit of work in, they're not our kind of client.

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

Yes. Yes. Yes.

rebecca_1_10-23-2024_170508:

we didn't do any kind of discovery call because our intake form was so big extensive that just by reading it, we could tell if we should be going out on a consult. In fact, we didn't even charge for our consults because we didn't give away design ideas on those. Our geography was very limited, so it wasn't a huge long commute no matter where we were going. And again, from the contact form, we knew if this was likely to be a sale. So when we would go to somebody's house, we sold 70 percent of every single project that we made the drive for. And that is all thanks to our website, because nobody called us. We didn't make it easy for them to call us. It all had to happen from the moment they landed on the website. Through that questionnaire.

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

love that. I love that. Um, Pricing is another thing that I think can be a little controversial since you mentioned that and

rebecca_1_10-23-2024_170508:

That was my next question.

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

oh, funny. We are sisters, aren't we? personally don't put pricing on my website, and, uh, I will share exactly why the reason is, I am not your cheapest option and I prefer not to compete on price. I feel that if I put a starting at price. It might cause some people not to reach out to me when there's a tremendous value that my team and I are bringing and I like the opportunity to actually get on a zoom call and share that, and then share the pricing. For my interior design clients, you know, I struggle with this sometimes. I think if they do offer a paid consultation, that's useful to put that price on the website because that's not varying. Right? But. You know, for your design fees and the scope of work, it's so custom to each client, um, that most of mine don't put pricing on. I also view interior design as a luxury service, whether you are budget friendly or not, you're still a want, not a need. It is my job and my copywriter's job to appeal to your potential clients on an emotional level through the messaging and the website design so that they are buying with their heart and not their head. Then price becomes somewhat less important. It's the transformation that they're buying and that we should be selling. So, um, that's, what's worked for me and for most of my clients, but I'd love to hear your positioning on pricing.

rebecca_1_10-23-2024_170508:

Our niche was mostly people who had never remodeled before and had never hired an interior designer before. So making people feel secure was actually part of our brand. My approach to almost every decision I made in my company was"what would I want if I were the client?" I don't need a specific price, but I don't want to walk into a boutique and find out that I'm three zeros under what they expect me to be paying for whatever. What I like as a client is I just want to know how many zeros am I getting myself involved in? So I believe in price signaling, which doesn't necessarily mean prices. So the way we said it was our designs start at 5, 000, but they average eight to 12. More importantly was the signaling that we shared around what remodels costs. So we had blogs on that. And then in our questionnaire, we would say things like kitchen starts at 85, 000 for the remodel.

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

And I love that the pricing tied into what your brand was all about. I think that's fabulous to hear. I love that. Something that I think can be really useful in your contact form is if you are asking potential clients to share investment level, giving a couple of ranges. And your lowest number could be your lowest number, right? So if your design fee starts at 10, 000 or something, then you want to make sure that you're pricing your lowest range significantly above that,

rebecca_1_10-23-2024_170508:

I love that because it really is about priming the brain. If you start your range at zero to 5, 000, you're signaling that it could be at zero,

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

right. Exactly. Exactly. And that's 1 of the reasons I don't put ranges on my website because I have, you know, the custom design, the templates that are significantly less and then SEO services where I start with an SEO audit that's under 1000. Since I'm appealing to different markets, having those ranges makes it really difficult. I don't want someone to think they can get a website for 995, you know. I don't Again, there's no right or wrong. It depends where your business is and what your business model is.

rebecca_1_10-23-2024_170508:

Exactly. Okay. So we were talking about the things that make you roll your eyes. Um, you said that we do need those professional photos and that a logo is not a brand. Does anything else come up for you where you're like, If they only knew this,

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

Um, if you build it, they will not come. Um, no, seriously, putting up a website, um, does not mean you're going to get any traffic to it. You need a marketing strategy. Marketing is awareness. How are you going to build awareness around this website so people visit it?

rebecca_1_10-23-2024_170508:

How much do you talk about marketing strategy with your clients? Cause that's a huge

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

yeah. yeah. It's a huge field. So your website is your most important marketing tool. It should be what all of your other marketing initiatives are working to drive traffic to. Because that's where a potential client can find out everything about you. So in my opinion, social media should be driving traffic to your website. Um, if you're doing podcasts appearances. That should drive traffic to your website. If you're guest blogging, that should drive traffic. if you're on YouTube or on Pinterest, if you're doing email marketing, calls to action should be getting people to your website. SEO is one piece of the marketing pie. It's not something that I push on my clients at all. While I'm an SEO specialist and I do discuss it with my clients and I want to make sure we're addressing it in the website build, it is not for everyone and it's not something that I feel everyone should have as part of their marketing plan. Searching online, you know, for interior designer near me is the way an enormous amount of people will look for an interior designer. Um, if you are at the very top echelon dealing with a very luxury client, I would say there's other marketing initiatives you should be doing. You should be, getting on boards of directors for local charities. You should be donating to auctions. You should be at the golf club with them. I mean, you need to be out there networking where they are. It's much more word of mouth referrals, and they're going to look at your website, Googling interior designer near me. So again, it really depends. Who your target audience is, what the best marketing strategy is going to be. Maybe your clients aren't on social media and then you shouldn't be there.

rebecca_1_10-23-2024_170508:

Yeah, you know, that was an eyeopener for me. I just was speaking at a home show in Eugene, Oregon. And, I do a lot of industry speaking and Instagram is the place where we all connect this audience. Was not on Instagram. It really reminded me because I was speaking to a different audience than I normally would be that you've got to think about where are your clients hanging out, this particular group of people was older, they're a little bit more rural. They're just not spending their time living on their phones, maybe Facebook, because they might've been keeping up with the grandkids. But this is profoundly interesting, you know, it depends on who are you trying to target? And that might not be online tools, which

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

everything. You physically cannot do everything, nor should you be doing everything. So, you should be spending your time on the marketing initiatives that are actually bringing leads to you. So don't be on Instagram if your clients aren't on Instagram. Right? Having 15, 000 followers means nothing if you have no engagement. So, we don't just want eyeballs. it's not a numbers game. Getting 15, 000 visitors to your website in one month means nothing if nobody converted and filled out your contact form. You need to think strategically about the content that you are creating Email marketing is not for everyone. A lead magnet is not for everyone. Like, I know that there's certain people who say you have to have a lead magnet. You have to have a lead magnet. No, you don't have to do anything. You should have a lead magnet. If email marketing is something that is important to you it's a great way to build your list.,. you know, sometimes this requires some testing. To figure out, and you need to stick with it for a little while and see what is your ROI

rebecca_1_10-23-2024_170508:

this comes back to the fact that you are in the interior design niche. A lot of the quote best practices and advice that we see on the internet is for people with like eShops where they're trying to sell t shirts and it is a numbers game. But interior design is not that field.

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

No, it's not. I mean, you do want to get in front of a lot of eyeballs because that's going to bring you more inquiries. And we're obviously not going to convert every inquiry, nor is every visitor to your website going to convert and fill out your contact form. So, it is a bit of a numbers game, but in a very different way than a shop would be for sure.

rebecca_1_10-23-2024_170508:

Exactly. And it goes right back to what we were saying, because there in fact are some interior designers who are selling low cost design templates or color palettes. And then it might be a numbers game and you might be trying to sell to a national or even international community. So it all comes back to strategy. I wanted to call out a different aspect because you've got who you want to work with. But you've also got your big business dreams, like having your own HGTV show. You know, if you want to be noticed by the media, whether that's El Decor or HGTV, The media is looking for something a bit different than clients are looking for. They expect you to have an audience, and so list building might not be related to getting your clients, but it might be related to a different business goal that you have.

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

Absolutely. That is such a great point. And again, it's individual to each business and each business owner. So you have to know what your priorities are and what you should be working toward.

rebecca_1_10-23-2024_170508:

final question around strategy and how this can kind of trickle out and get bigger and bigger and bigger. what are the conversations that you have, if any, around like social media and the other visual marketing assets they might create? So

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

don't do anything with social media for my clients. I'll talk to them about SEO and about email marketing only because that needs to be connected and integrated into their website. And we need to know about that in the website build, you know, are we working with an email marketing platform? do we need landing pages for, forms to fill out things like that. Other than that, for my web design clients, I'm not really talking to them about social media initiatives, things like that. For my monthly SEO clients, we are talking about marketing because, um, they need to get out there and get backlinks to their website. So that's when we start getting a lot more strategic about that.

rebecca_1_10-23-2024_170508:

What would you like to leave interior designers with? What message do you want them to take away today?

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

see, that's a really good question. I would say 1 thing that I would love to share is interior design and website design. While we're both designers and we're both creatives, your zone of genius is designing a functional and beautiful space. And my zone of genius is designing a functional, and beautiful website. There isn't much crossover. I need help picking paint color in my home and you guys need help with your website design. I can tell a DIY website a mile away.

rebecca_1_10-23-2024_170508:

Just like professional photography. It doesn't mean we can't go a long way on our own. And it doesn't even mean that we couldn't learn these skills, but is that really the skill set we need to be putting our time into if we're trying to grow an interior design business, not a web design

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

Exactly. Exactly. Yeah. I always say you have to sacrifice something. It's time or money. So you either need to take your time and learn how to do it yourself, or you need to invest in hiring a professional to do it. Absolutely.

rebecca_1_10-23-2024_170508:

Absolutely true. And And everybody can hear the truth of that when they think about how we talk to our interior design clients. It's exactly the same conversation, no right or wrong, and no one's going to die if somebody makes a bad paint color choice bye. You want to make sure that you're investing the time and money in the way that's going to give you the outcome you need based on the goals that you have.

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

Couldn't agree more.

rebecca_1_10-23-2024_170508:

Oh, Robin, this has been absolutely fantastic. Obviously I will have all of your contact information in the show notes, but for anybody who's listening, what's the easiest way for them to reach out to you?

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

Oh, sure. They can connect with me on Instagram and that's rdwdesignstudio and they can also take a look at my website, which is rdwdesignstudio. com.

rebecca_1_10-23-2024_170508:

Fantastic. Thank you so much for giving us your time today.

robyn-white_1_10-23-2024_110610:

Thank you for having me. It was a pleasure.

Well, my friends, I hope you enjoyed my conversation with Robin. I think that point about showcasing not only your best work, but also the work you want more of is worthy of saying again, Clients take our portfolio photos, literally. So it is important as early in your career as possible to create a portfolio that reflects the kinds of projects you want. How do you do that? Well first, you've got to decide what you want to design and for whom you want to design it. You've got to start with that step. Until you do that, you're just going to be throwing spaghetti at the wall. Then you'll want to develop a marketing strategy, including that kick ass website that attracts those kinds of projects to you. When it comes to your portfolio projects honestly, it's okay to do some smaller projects and take vignette style photos as long as they represent the kind of work and the luxury level on the attention to detail. That will actually be present through any kind of project that you do, no matter the size. The main point is that the longer you wait to ask for what you want the longer you'll be working on projects that don't show off your passion and your talents and your unique designer's point of view. And by the way, if you're still in those first few years as a design business owner at the level where maybe you're still DIY in your own copy and your own website, I'd like to invite you to check out my business accelerator. It's built just for interior designers. It's called lead to launch, and it's meant to help you narrow your firm's focus so that you can develop a powerful marketing strategy. That will attract clients that you love and projects that you will be proud of. And you can learn more about that over@seriouslyhappy.com. And of course, if this conversation resonated with you, you know, I'd love to hear about it. So come find me on Instagram at B seriously happy that's B E seriously happy let's be friends and celebrate all the things that we're doing together as entrepreneurs and interior designers. Bye for now.